the view from the stage
Judy Bond: interview with Thom Yorke
// «intelligent houskeepers mag», 1999
:: english original
In the next world war
in a jackknifed juggernaut
I am born again
in the neon sign scrolling up and down
i am born again/in an interstella burst
I am back to save the universe.
Radiohead. "Airbag"
Earlier this
year my son Arthur introduced me to the British rock group Radiohead
by playing their song "Karma Police." My curiosity about the
Buddhist reference overcame my parental apprehension about his interest
in alternative rock and what my husband and I perceive to be its associated
vices. It's easy to forget that I survived a similar passion starting
with the likes of Screaming Jay Hawkins and Clarence "Frogman"
Henry on black radio in Norfolk, Virginia. This was in the days before
Buddy Holly, Elvis and the Beatles.
Listening to Radiohead's CDs, I was intrigued by the
band's ability to combine desolate lyrics with uplifting melodies. Any
irony was overridden by the beauty of lead singer Thom Yorke's voice,
especially when soaring in falsetto range. However bleak and cold the
modern landscape sketched by the lyrics, a transcendent optimism, perennial
as grass, emerged through the cracks in the cement. (continued)
I wanted to interview this thoughtful young man Thom
Yorke and find out why he was drawn to the cause of Tibet. This summer's
Tibetan Freedom Concert was the second he and his band had played, and
on the second day of the concert, we were ushered into Radiohead's dressing
room tent next to the stadium and introduced to Thom. I sat down beside
him on the couch and my son Arthur took a chair. I took out my long
list of questions; Thom said, "Blimey!"
_____________________
First of all, let me thank you as a parent.
Why?
My generation has screwed things up.
(laughs)
Yeah. I know.
And Rome is burning.
Yeah. It is, isn't it.
And so for us parents, I'm very grateful that
you've become a light in the darkness. I worry about him (I motion
toward Arthur).
(to Arthur)
There you go.
So let me thank you for maintaining your optimism.
Well, I've been reading a lot about the fifty years
since the Second World War, about Western foreign policy and all that.
I try not to let it get to me, but sometimes I just think that there's
no hope. Then I realize, "Well, hang on, that's what they'd love
us to believe. "It's a fight, a mental fight. I grew up under Thatcher.
I grew up believing that I was fundamentally powerless. Then gradually
over the years it occurred to me that this was actually a very convenient
myth for the state.
So you've chosen to exert your power by helping
the Tibetan cause. I understand you were very moved by the first Tibetan
Freedom Concert you did.
I was very moved indeed. It came at a crucial point
for us; it was the beginning of promoting our album "OK Computer."
We were very nervous and didn't know what to expect, but when we came
backstage, there was a little note saying, "Please leave your egos
behind." That was a big thing for me. Coming from Britain, I was
terrified of meeting all these other artists, because artists over there
tend to fight with each other a lot, the premise being that there's
not enough room for everybody. But we got over here and all the other
artists were incredibly friendly.
You spoke eloquently at the press conference about
the plight of the Tibetan people. How did you get interested in the
Tibetan cause?
Well, I really got interested in it when I bought
a copy of The Tibetan Book of the Dead, translated by Robert Thurman.
There's a great introduction to Buddhism in that, a good twenty pages.
Then I read Sogyal Rinpoche's The Tibetan Book of Living and Dying,
which didn't feel like a religious book in the normal sense. It felt
like common sense from start to finish. I guess that's what wisdom is,
really. It's the most extraordinary thing I've ever read.
The problem is, I cannot meditate. That's the one
thing I can't do. That's the thing that's driving me nuts. I have a
house by the sea, and I can sit and listen to the sound of the sea and
eventually... but I can't really do it. I think there are lots of reasons
for it. My excuse has always been that music does it for me. I think
it does, but not often enough to justify saying that. It's the same
kind of thing because you are not wrapped up in your thoughts anymore.
So when it works it's really good.
It was very good of you to break your holiday
after the world tour and come back from England to donate your performance
this weekend and appear tomorrow at the rally.
I couldn't have lived with myself if we hadn't done
it. It's like trying to give something back after a year of taking and
taking. For me and I think for most of the artists here, Tibet is the
final test. If they let Tibet be wiped out then...
This is not the first cause that you've promoted.
There was something called Warchild.
Yeah, it's about the Bosnian crisis principally.
Generally speaking I think that sometimes charity is cosmetic. I mean,
the only reason the Bosnian situation got out of control was that the
U.N. and Western Europe turned a blind eye. Leading up to the war, they
kept having these talks: everyone turns up in suits with briefcases,
including the Serbs, and just because they sat down at what the Western
Europeans deemed their level, they were fooled blind. The Serbs committed
mass murder, genocide, the most revolting crimes, but if they send someone
off in a suit with a briefcase, then everything is fine. It's completely
cosmetic. I think sometimes all the charities are doing is mopping up
the blood. It's a shame. This is the black hole I always get lost in,
so I'll pull myself out now.
The thing about the Tibetan cause is that it's a
bit more positive because of the nonviolence element and because there
is no China-hating involved. Then it makes a bit more sense.
There's a moral stance you take with your audience.
Yeah, which is dangerous. But there you go.
Well, you're up there in a position where people
listen to what you say. I appreciate that you do that for them.
That comes from my dad, actually. My dad spent his
whole life getting into fights for telling what he believed to be the
truth. Basically it comes from my dad-and he's screaming right-wing,
so there you are.
Going back to the nonviolence that's being promoted
here, I've read that because of other children teasing you about your
damaged eye, you had to defend yourself with your fists.
Yeah, again that's from my father.
Looking back on those years now, how do you feel
about the fighting?
(long pause)
Well, it only dawned on me about six months ago that not everybody's
against me all the time. It was something of a revelation (laughing)...
that's all I can say really.
How many of your fans do you think are interested
in the Tibetan cause?
I don't know. There's something in the music about
trying to validate yourself, and I hope through that they'll see why
we're so interested in the Tibetan movement. I haven't really gotten
any feedback from them, but that's why we've kept going on about it.
Maybe it does some good or maybe it washes over people, but if it was
me and I was getting newsletters talking about it, then I would probably
try to find out more. That's what U2 did for Amnesty International during
the eighties, and it really worked.
Our generation for so long has genuinely believed
it has no power at all. Have you seen that Pepsi advert where they are
all going "aaaahhhhh youth!!" (thrusts his hand out as
if holding soda can) and they get their kicks jumping off mountains
or something? That's the conclusion of something. I think we should
move on from there. I don't think young people are as demoralized as
the media and government would like us to think. The obvious sign of
that is how strong and how close personal connections are and how much
people are able to build a life for themselves, despite all this stuff
that's been thrown at them.
Noam Chomsky has said that any member of society
can change things simply by their consumer power. If nothing else at
all, if you don't write letters or anything else, if you don't buy any
of this stuff, the companies will freak out. It's that easy.
The next day at the National
Day for Tibet rally on the Capitol lawn, Thom Yorke closes out the speeches
by singing "Street Spirit." He shouts "Power for the
people" and departs the stage. Sogyal Rinpoche takes the mike and
leads the gathering in a few closing prayers, among them four lines
from The Guide to the Bodhisattva's Way of Life:
"For as long as space endures/ And for as long as living beings
remain/ Until then may I abide/To dispel the misery of the world";
and from the Four Immeasurables:
"May all beings enjoy happiness and the root of happiness/ May
they be free of suffering and the root of suffering/ May they not be
separated from the great happiness devoid of suffering/ May they dwell
in equanimity free from passion, aggression, and ignorance."